While I don't have any particular resources, I would just warn you that
shamanism is something of a popular topic among "new agers" right now, so
you will find a lot of speculation about shamanism that has more to do with
modern popular conceptions of shamanism (of whatever flavor) than with
actual practice.

(I don't intend this as a criticism of new agers, just a warning that
looking for information on shamanism is like looking for information on yoga
or feng shui right now — you'll find a lot about "California" versions of
each topic, and a lot less about actual practice in traditional settings.)

I would go to a University library if possible and search anthropology,
ethnology and folklore databases for articles on shamanism and Hungary.

Be aware as well that a lot of what will be said will, by necessity, be
conjecture. That is why you have already found conflicting statements. Most
statements are going to be "best guesses".

I would ignore the statements that shamanism is the result of "spiritual
disease" because, if nothing else, that attitude will tell you absolutely
nothing about shamanism from the perspective of individuals who practice it.
It tells you only about the perspective of the individual who dislikes it.
Learning about it that way would be like picking up an anti-Catholic tract
from English Puritans 400 years ago to get a picture of "real" Catholicism.
(Not that I am worried about you taking the claim too seriously.)

One last thought is, if you are interested in the idea that it was an
ancestral characteristic in common with various other Uralic peoples, try
looking up works by Pentikainen on Saami shamanism and check his references.
Juhani Pentikainen is a recognized expert on Saami shamanism and would be a
good start. (He is also a very nice man and if you can find his contact
information, which I don't have at present, he would probably point you in
the right direction.)

Regards,

Arle

Arle does a disservice to science fiction writers by claiming we can't know
the what ifs. Actually what makes good sci-fi, (not star trek) is fairly
accurate guessing as to what if. Arle would I am sure, be happy to agree
that the real outcome of a meeting between a modern carrier force and WW-2
era navy could have only one result. That is exactly right. Two or three
passes at supersonic speeds over the Japaneese flag ships, and the whole
fleet would run for home. Good science fiction.

Unless of course you are a proponent of the theory that the Japanese would
clean the carrier forces clock?? (bad sci-fi).

Just so, it is possible to make some fairly astute guesses in historical
what if scenarios. Militarily, the Magyars represented a far more formidable
and advanced force than Europe had to offer between the 9 and 11 centuries.
Their superiority was based upon the innate superiority of light cavalry
over heavy cavalry in most instances. Heavy cavalry was next to useless in
all but the most particular circumstances. If an enemy could be caught in a
confined area, or between two forces, heavy cavalry would crush them. In the
open, they were slow, easy to tire, easy prey to archers, etc. The Magyars
took full advantage of this situation, raiding freely into the heart of
Europe.

Why did Europe persist in a form of warfare that was so obviously second
rate? The feudal system demanded it. The subservience of the lower class was
mandatory. Arming them to a point where they could endanger the ruling class
was anathema. Feilding a citizen army died as a concept with the Roman
Rebublic, and standing proffessional armies were simply beyond economic
feasability in a fuedal economy. Hence Europe required it's ruling class to
be it's warrior class, it's arms to be vastly superior to that of it's
peasant classes. Result, steel encased knights on giant horses, fully
capable of crushing poorly outfitted opposing infantry (peasants with staves
usually), possibly each other (in a battle of equals), but useless against
the technologically advanced Asians.

Against this the nomadic Magyars, vast numbers (every man a trained
warrior), lightly armoured, on small hardy horses, equipped with the
composite bow, tore the Europeans to shreds. Their tactics of lightening
strikes, combined with devastating mounted archery, could not be withstood
by the clumsy Europeans. Well at least for a few hundred years, when in a
mindlessly stupid move, the Magyars allowed themselves to be caught against
a riverbank, and were crushed by the heavy armour of European chivalry,
thus destroying forever the only force in Europe capable of withstanding
similarly equipped Asian forces.

Well mindlessly stupid, or were Magyars already changing? What makes a Nomad
forget how to fight? Would the term agriculture have something to do with
it? Picture a nomadic tribe, on the move, hunting gathering, fighting.
Picture the skill sets involved. Archery, (a lifetime pursuit) horsemanship,
(the same) fighting skills, strategy, tactics, etc. All in all a lifestyle
that must be maintained, to learn the life skills that one must have.

Now picture the same tribe, on a piece of land. archery? horsemanship?
fighting skills, all take a back seat to planting, weeding, building,
watering, harvesting, etc. (No wonder the European infantry were useless).
The Magyars got sucked in. Nice place the Carpathian basin. Too bad it
wasn't big enough to support wondering and marauding as a full time
occupation. Sooner or later, they had to get off the horse and plant
something. After a while, they could not remember their own arts of war,

Istvan was no saint, but he was no dummy either. His choices were stark.
Give up what we have and be the most European of Europeans, or go back to
the steppes. The Magyars were losing their way of life to their
circumstances already. Marauding through Europe was not going to work for
long. Christianity itself was merely symbolic of a change already underway,
already changing the way the Magyars lived,

The Magyars were accepting the land. They were accepting the feudal method
of owning it. In that acceptance lay their future, for good or ill.
Christianity simply went along for the ride.

In answer then to the question what would have been different without the
forced christianisation of the Magyars. Nothing. Sometimes history just
coughs up the same answer. (Even if it is Sci Fi)

Val Fekete

Discussion/Fórum